Meeting in Port Elizabeth, 31 March 1971

D.N. Your list of sins since the first of January, please.

A.J.McM. First sin, violation of Matthew 18.

D.N. Yes, universally, including in this city. Next one?

A.J.McM. I have got a list here. There was interference with the Lord’s rights in this city by persons phoning up.

D.N. Yes, that is Glanton.

A.J.McM. Then there were persons in this city listening to unwitnessed scandal against the Lord’s servant and against the truth.

D.N. That is a universal charge against someone. That is a violation of the principle that at the mouth of two or three witnesses everything will be established. Not at the mouth of gossipers. Next thing?

A.J.McM. There was Harrow’s disregard for what this assembly found re facts witnessed to them.

D.N. Now that would need some clarification, I think.

C.O.B. I thought you were asking him for his sins.

D.N. Oh, no.

C.O.B. Oh, I misunderstood you . . .

D.N. Who wants to hear his sins, or your sins, or my sins, who wants to?

C.O.B. I can’t find them.

D.N. Can’t find yours?

C.O.B. No.

D.N. That’s right, yes.

A.J.McM. All I meant was, when it was said to persons ‘conscience not being carried’, they did not regard that, give that the weight that they should have given it.

D.N. Yes, that is right. So what would that be? The thing is the devil has invaded the assembly through sweeping aside divine principle after divine principle. The one divine principle that has been swept aside is Matthew 18. The next one was Glanton; that is, each local assembly answers to the Lord and to no other local assembly at all. That is not independency. You seek to carry every assembly in what you do but Glanton is that you can’t interfere with a man and his wife. No one has got a right to come between a man and his wife. Harrow had no business whatever poking their nose into the Lord’s relations with this meeting here. That is what it was doing, poking its nose in, every few minutes. ‘How are you getting on? Are you getting on alright with your wife?’ That is what it was doing. One of the first principles in scripture – Adam and Eve and no one else around but God, watching. Right, is that clear, is that as clear as the light is clear? Matthew 18 – Glanton. Right, next one?

A.J.McM. Well, there was the rebellion here . . .

D.N. Yes, rebellion – pre-arranged walking out on the Spirit of God by persons deciding what they will do first and not waiting on the Lord in the assembly. So it is an absolute setting aside of His headship by party activity to thwart the assembly. They decided in private that they would walk out of the assembly, absolute flouting of His headship. Next thing?

A.J.McM. Well, there was dishonesty in certain persons too.

D.N. You need not say much more – without are liars. Right next one?

A.J.McM. Well, there is the removal of franchise without witness and there was the action of Somerset East refusing to come and see and accepting the lies. It is really unfaithfulness to the Lord.

D.N. Yes, so that is Thou shalt not remove thy neighbour’s landmark, Deut. 19: 14. That is what that is. You are to protect your neighbour’s landmark; they just remove it without even worrying to come.

C.O.B. Ecclesiastical assumption.

D.N. Yes, that is right, that is what it is.

A.J.McM. Then there is violation of 2 Timothy 2 in Johannesburg three-day meetings in meeting with persons under discipline in this city.

D.N. Yes.

A.J.McM. Then there is the interference of that bastard in Somerset East with Jansenville.

D.N. Glanton again.

A.J.McM. There is also the brethren’s failure to see the attack on the Lord’s humanity.

D.N. Yes, well that is so.

A.J.McM. Well, that is as far as I got.

D.N. And then I tell you another one is open brethrenism, failure to see the attack on the Lord’s humanity is open brethrenism.

A.J.McM. That is what I was thinking.

E.W.P. There was also interference in the service of God here.

D.N. In the service of God? Yes, that’s right. A sister gave out a hymn, a man interrupts it with an administrative matter, he interfered with the service of God.

A.J.P.K. Is another one, not naming things? I mean what was said here; they just referred to iniquity but there was no naming of it and no witness brought forward.

D.N. Yes. It’s Matthew 18 again, acting against someone without two witnesses establishing it – at the mouth of two or three witnesses every matter shall be established; not so? It says that.

R.S.J.J. And Emmanuel’s land?

D.N. Yes, invasion of Emmanuel’s land. That is very important, universal invasion of Emmanuel’s land. The assumption that they can judge motives in other people, go inside people and think what they are thinking, interpret what they are thinking.

J.A.P. Was there not also the wrongful withdrawal from persons because of their convictions?

D.N. Yes, refusal of witness, and what our brother says, refusal to respect a person’s convictions, a brother’s conscience.

E.W.P. There was really the crucifixion of the Spirit of Christ and Paul too, wasn’t there?

D.N. That is in all this thing. That is a broad thing, that.

E.W.P. Yes, but I was only thinking of the fact of defranchising, the impetuousness of it.

D.N. Yes, that’s right, but the impetuousness was displayed in the actual breaking of divine principles.

L.E.B. Wasn’t all that the result of something else, deeper?

D.N. Yes, that’s true. We want to be in the light – what was the deeper thing?

L.E.B. Well, what I discern is a conspiracy to grab the power.

D.N. Yes, it is still going on. Put that down too – conspiracy.

L.E.B. What the world calls a coup, C-O-U-P.

D.N. Yes, coup d’etat.

A.H.P. Then sovereignty is the Lord’s matter.

D.N. Sovereignty – that’s the thing. The issue is sovereignty.

L.S.B. Then they never used Genesis 9. If they thought there was evil, they did not cover it.

D.N. Yes, violation of Genesis 9.

L.S.B. The matter of wrong doctrine, too – they accused us of this.

D.N. Yes, that was covered by this other one though, invasion of Emmanuel’s land – they interpreted what people were meaning. The other thing is Genesis 9 and violation of Matthew 5. . . . Yes I have got something against these men. They are just going on with the service of God, they must come and see me. Against almost all of them, I have got something. Allen Gadsden, he is guilty every time he breaks bread, he must come and see me first, and leave his gift there and come and see me first, be reconciled to me. Symington must come too. James the third must come. Maynard . . . not interested in him coming – he is out of everything – that’s the truth.

D.J.P. There is the guilty editor too.

D.N. Yes, he is a P.E.G., a stuffed P.E.G.

A.G.J.J. So is another one the printing of this stuff instead of J.T.’s ministry?

D.N. Yes, that’s right, . . . that’s dishonesty. They took money out of us to print J.T. Jr’s ministry and they print something else. Let your yea be yea. They say they are going to do it and they do something else.

L.E.B. There was the violation of 2 Timothy 2 in this doctrine that you must accept a judgment even if it’s wrong.

D.N. Yes, that’s right.

R.S.J.J. Insubjection in sisters?

D.N. Insubjection in sisters! Thank God you said it! Wholesale!

L.S.B. Rejection of the spirit of J.T. Jr. too.

D.N. Yes.

D.J.P. How do you regard the word given here of allegiance and turning back on it?

D.N. Well, traitor, in character it’s Judas. Especially his declaration that that hall was secure, when questioned. Do you remember that? When asked what’s the position with that hall, he said, ‘Well, Mr Parker’s gone but two trustees remain so the hall is secure’. Then he goes away and steals it. Theft of meeting room. You must put that down too.

A.J.McM. And in that regard their public court statement that they are prepared to compromise.

D.N. Yes, well that’s a violation of 2 Timothy 2. Now, brethren, you don’t want to be too complacent, you want to see that this attack is the greatest attack on the truth since the recovery. You people want to see that because more is coming, not less. The devil is on the warpath but the Lord is on the warpath before him. But you want to wake up and act before the devil acts. It’s critical. If you are asleep, the devil will catch you sleeping. He will pump you full of bullets and say ‘Look at him, still sleeping’. Watch and pray, watch and pray, watch and pray!

D.J.P. J.T. Jr. said the devil is particularly after a pure man. And after ‘Peter’.

D.N. Yes, that’s right, he goes after a pure man to try and corrupt him. All the time he will be at you. Now do you brethren believe me? I tell you it’s the truth, it is the greatest attack on the recovery, it exceeds Bethesda, it exceeds Glanton, it exceeds anything that has happened in the recovery of the truth, this present attack.

A.J.P.K. It seems to include them all.

D.N. It includes them all. There is glory in what He has done and the devil is terribly worried by what is happening here. We are stinging him tonight again, indicting the devil and we indict the devil in these people. They are not going to escape; they are guilty. Another violation of principle, that the man is the head of his house. He must deal with matters in his house. They just take things out of their houses into the assembly.

C.O.B. What did you have in mind?

D.N. Well, if something happens in a man’s house, he must deal with it in his house. These men, they say things happen in their houses, they say sin occurred in their houses; they did nothing about it; the next thing is they bring it up publicly in the assembly – absolute violation of principle. And other people bring up things that happen in someone else’s house. How can I bring up something that happens in someone else’s house? It is his administration; it has got nothing to do with the assembly.

D.W.M. And that is a principle that you can’t take up a man’s matters somewhere else.

D.N. Yes, that is another thing, judging a man in another locality.

J.A.P. An attack on priesthood – Numbers 16.

D.N. Yes – Numbers 16. You must get this list finished, you brethren, I want to go home.

A.J.P.K. Harassing the priesthood. Is that covered by the reference to the attack on the priesthood?

D.N. That’s right. We are not finished.

A.H.P. Then an assembly judgment must be according to the doctrine and must be based on fact.

D.N. Yes, that’s right; the doctrine is Matthew 18.

A.H.P. That is really why we could not accept, or why our consciences were not carried by, Harrow’s judgement. It was not based on fact.

L.S.B. And we said, too, the other night that the rebels’ action (in walking out) was not an assembly action. I think it is good to see that. Is that covered by the reference to rebellion? Their action was not an assembly action.

D.N. Yes, that is right.

A.J.McM. Can this one be made clear: ‘a man the head of his home’, a violation of that? What specific thing is in mind there?

D.N. Oh, a whole string of things. If I go to your house and I go and do something and sin in your house, you can’t go, and no one else that is in your house can go, and bring it up in the assembly: it’s your matter to control that, it’s your house. You must deal with evil in your house.

A.J.McM. That is very good to see.

D.N. They threw that to the four winds . . . make universal charges of what has happened in houses, without the head of the house ever having acted; he never acted. There is not a person, I tell you brethren the truth, there is not a person that ever told me anywhere that I sinned in any house, never; and in fact I can bring plenty of witnesses to say they were fully with me, outwardly, and very glad to enjoy it while the going was good. They were, especially that fat bum!

S.E.E. What about Somerset East receiving these rebels en bloc back into so-called fellowship?

D.N. Yes, that is the same as Jo’burg. That is right, that is the same principle, the violation of 2 Timothy 2. Open brethrenism, do you get that? They will not even listen to what happened, they say it is too far away to know the details. They are in fellowship with them, anyway – open brethrenism!

D.W.M. But they reject the witness of the nearest meeting.

A.J.McM. That is really a violation of Leviticus 4 is it not? A sin of inadvertence, they did not find out.

D.N. That is right, and the the city nearest the slain man (Deut. 21).

K.O.M. There is that chap who withdrew from me on Monday night and from many of us on Tuesday and then he showed up here for the walk-out in the evening. He had no right to come in here.

D.N. Right. Are you finished?

A.J.McM. I have certainly got a terrible bag full.

D.N. No guts. Put down ‘no guts’. A violation of another principle; you must have guts! It says so. Did you have false witness down?

A.J.McM. No, not that I remember.

D.N. Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour, Exodus 20: 16. Yes, put it down if you have not got it.

J.A.P. Humiliation of a sister in Barbados.

D.N. Yes, and we had refusal of witness; that was also in Barbados, and did you have attack on the Lord’s servant?

A.J.McM. Yes.

D.N. It was very strong at Barbados, the attack on J.T. Jr. – very strong. Have you got that?

A.J.McM. Yes.

D.N. It is Romans 14: 4, to his own master he stands or falls. Another very important one, a very important one, is false doctrine, limiting the Spirit of God, saying He can only do a thing once. How can mortal man say how many times the Spirit can do a thing?

L.E.B. There is another one there, the flouting of God’s sovereignty because they said that J.T. Jr. was the only one that had that authority.

D.N. Well, that is what I am saying, limiting the Spirit of God, false doctrine: it is all one piece, that thing.

J.A.P. One of the main things that seemed to come up there was to make a difference between what he said in the house and what he said publicly.

D.N. Yes, we will put that down too. Another one of false doctrine – Roman Catholic doctrine of ‘ex cathedra’. They say it is only when the Pope speaks ‘ex cathedra’ that he is infallible. At other times he is supposed to be talking nonsense!

D.J.P. What about where they named what you taught as to the matter of apostleship and purity as being heretical and yet they said the same thing at different times?

D.N. Yes, by a man’s words he shall be justified and by a man’s words he shall be condemned (Matthew 12: 37).

S.E.E. By refusing to accept what the man of God said in the house, are they not really discarding all those letters of J.N.D. and F.E.R. and J.T.?

D.N. Yes.

A.J.P.K. Have we got, universal charge?

A.J.McM. No.

D.N. Universal charge is another violation of principle.

Rem. There is no such thing as a universal priesthood, is there?

D.N. There is such a thing as a universal priesthood, but there can be no such thing as universal charges against a man.

A.H.P. Then, the new covenant.

D.N. Yes, the setting aside of the new covenant in Barbados and in England and in South Africa. Where’s the hymn or have you got another one?

A.J.McM. No, that is all.